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[Applause] greetings to everyone from a Royal City of London I’m here with Sir Joel a guy a knight who is protecting people from from back pain yesterday I had a tremendous course a really really almost a life-changing course even though even though I translated Stuart’s book back mechanic and I know Stu would read everything from from him this course bad mechanic course still taught me and showed me some things that I didn’t knew before and I think that it’s really a great opportunity for all of us here all of you the viewers to get in touch with our today’s guest mr. Joe Swanson thank you so Joel Tammy yesterday you had this course back mechanic it follows the book back mechanic but can you tell me who do you think and how do you think that this course helps different types of professionals from physios strength and conditioning coaches medics maybe even how do you think why or why I think this course is so essential for Harry everyone who is dealing with Batman nation’s jury that’s a it’s a great question and before I answer that question if I may digress just for one second 12 years ago when I arrived in this country in the United Kingdom I never thought coming from South Africa 12 years later I would ever be introduced as a knight who lives in the Royal City of London helping people with their back pay so I’m very very humbled and very grateful with such a fantastic introduction and thank you for for interviewing me and asking me these questions well to answer your question that’s a really good question because a lot of people think that the back mechanic course is directed purely to trainers and only trainers and in actual fact it is not and the first time we ran the course which was last year November in in London at performance Oryx we had I would say that 50 to 60 percent of the attendees were actually clinicians so there were chiropractor Ostia osteopaths and physiotherapists and also I did the course now in Madrid in Spain back in my believe it was March and I think it was May actually and I had 32 attendees on the course and all of them were physiotherapists so the back mechanic course basically takes streamer Gil’s 32 years of intensive research and study and strips it down to its most basic form however it does not digress away from the important stuff that Hugh has researched independent all we doing is we are packaging it and producing a product that is I would probably say a little bit easier to digest then a lot of the other courses that we do which are a lot more intensive there are a lot more clinical based however the reason that I would say that mechanic is a great course for clinicians is because coming in from a trainers perspective which is what I am on the state of condition in college we get to disseminate the information with a little bit of a different twist a twist from a trainers perspective and how we deal with people who walk into the gym with you know all types of low back pain that doesn’t really require the skills and the hands and the eyes or the Commission but can be overcome by trainers in a gym environment and what their adds to the clinical toolbox is just another element another another way of looking at Stu’s amazing sort of work of research over his over his career so really it’s it’s a it’s just a little

bit of a stripped down version but not a rot sorry what have you have not dropped from absolutely it is it is it’s got all of the of the the jewels and the gems of SKUs work so you you make the simpler but not simple absolutely absolutely not easily not to be not you know removing any of the of the main working parts of effective pros work and and what would you say are the main the main parts of stews and you’re thinking about mapping because a lot of people tell me oh there are so many methods of back pain treatments that I don’t even know anymore what to do you know which methods to take but I think that the students method is more our way of thinking and that’s what they differentiate it from other methods and what is in European few basic foundations that Stuart’s work is so different well the funny thing is this is there’s a very famous saying jury that is put out there they say that common sense is not so common anymore Donna Spain correct so and I believe that what’s too has managed to and to put out there is just a very logical practical way of listening to a patient getting to understand this story and combining that with very detailed clinical testing procedures that allow you to reach a precise understanding of a biomechanical problem that is causing that patient’s back pain and it is you know when you follow it there’s a very famous saying by Bruce Lee and this is how I’m going to encapsulate how I look at Juice method or system in a way that we that we analyze and assess backbone bruce lee said before i studied the art a punch was a punch and a kick was a kick I then started to study the art and a punch wasn’t just a punch in the kick wasn’t just a kick but now that I know the art the punches a punch in the kick is a kick and that’s exactly how I look it’s use amazing work is there when when I first met him I thought oh well this is simple you know you just you pull on someone’s leg and you push on their spine and then you get into the details of it and the minutiae and the understanding that you know how you assess someone in the amount of force that you use and how you talk to them the words that you use everything is extremely important and calculated but now that I’ve been doing it for for 12 years you know to assist our clients back pain is something that I do on a daily basis but so so I think Stu has put together a very logical thinking persons approach to understanding the patient and then utilizing a very practical form of biomechanical testing that’s that’s very good what you mentioned biomechanical way of thinking because a lot of people they think wrongly the stuarts way of treating back pain it’s only only for mechanical on a only for mechanical understanding but actually at the end it’s all about understanding people came in here because yesterday also heard from you some very good ways how to approach people and can you explain us a bit because there’s a big confusion currently on the field people usually think that biomechanical world and psychological world can’t go hand in hand but basically how you how you how you how you teach people and how you work with them really affects that pain as well okay very much so I can’t elaborate on that and it’s a it’s a subject that’s becoming very close to my heart because the you know I’m part of that for pro and if that really upsets me when people out there say that all that we do is we look at the mechanical aspect of pain and we dismiss the psychosocial aspect which we definitely do not and a lot of people that say the jury are the people that actually have never been to our courses and in fact they’ve probably gone so far

as to never even read any of Jews work and they have a very strong opinion unfortunately but we take these psychosocial aspects extremely importantly we take it very seriously and but how we do that is we assess the person the moment they walk in so as I have an example yesterday the way I’m going to treat someone who is a young a will champion strongman that has spent their whole life lifting a hundred and fifty kilogram plus logs above their head who is a phenomenal resilient human being who understands the the world of high level the lyrics is I’m gonna treat them very very differently to the way I’m going to treat the middle-aged woman who lives in this area who whose total amount of athleticism is taking her two dogs for a week every day so I’m going to use different language I’m going to be a little bit more gentle I’m going to be a little bit more softer with her and and again it’s not that I’m going I’m gonna dismiss anything because she’s not mathlete I’m just going to be able to extract athleticism from her in a different way and generally what tends to happen is that if we can assess what the pain trigger is and remove the pain trigger and give them an alternative way to do their exercises and their their their physical endeavors being pain-free that generally has a very positive psychological benefit for the person so I’m not a psychologist I can’t sit and console them verbally okay because that’s not my area of expertise as a psychologist but I can use my expertise as a coach as someone who deals with back pain to allow these people to see that there’s a light at the end of the tunnel and when that happens generally the results are positive however however is always a cab yet it takes two to tango and I am NOT someone that I want people to see over and over and over again I want to be the person that empowers the patient to look after their own spine however a lot of patients don’t have or don’t don’t want to have that ability to look after themselves and that becomes for me I believe a little bit more of a psycho social patient that requires to see a therapist to someone on a more ongoing basis and again we can’t help everyone just like any physio or chiropractor or any therapist they can’t help everyone but we can do our best to give our patients and our clients the tools to empower themselves to look after themselves so that they can hopefully get out of pain get back into their physical endeavors etc but we all know that pain is a multifactorial thing some people may never get out of pain some people may get out of pain within two or three weeks after seeing me everything is different I can not guarantee anything no one can guarantee anything the only thing I can guarantee is that the patient or walk out of here knowing this one better than they’ve ever known it they will be empowered we will not create any fear or furor avoidance as a lot of people think that we do we definitely do not and generally people walk out here having a very positive experience understanding the michiel assessment protocols and exercise transcription that’s a really good term you used empowering the people would you say this is basically one of the basic foundations of McGill’s also goals and his his work it basically teaches people how to become self-dependent more maybe probably it’s something I think that differentiates materials work from other other methods because usually people who like to rely on passive or treatments and passive therapy sure they do I do and and funny enough that’s why before and this is something

I’ve implemented recently and and before I get to see back pain patients now I speak to them on the telephone first because I want to I want both of us both myself and the patient to come to an understanding of expectations and before we get to meet and I need to make sure that actually I am the man to assist him because in some cases I’m not and they need a therapist that they can see on a more regular basis where they have a little bit more of a dependent relationship with their therapist and there’s nothing wrong with that after you know if that’s what drives some people and some therapist there that’s absolutely fine but that’s not what the definitely what we are about it’s not what we teach and it’s definitely or not or not what juist thousands that you should be coming to see him over and over and over again not at all in fact it’s very very rare that you will see people for a second or a third time he does the initial consultation generally the the patient’s cleaner or clinician joins them in the session jus gives them the tools and they go off and they work so it’s what I definitely don’t want people to become reliant on me I want to empower people I want to I want to get emails from them or telephone calls from them you know six months or three months down the lines and Joel I’m back cycling or I’m back doing gymnastics or whatever I need to do that for me is an absolute winning result or not yeah I’ve also seen that what is interesting about your your way of working with patients is that you are not afraid to cooperate with other professions you have I’ve seen any in the alley that you have physiotherapists that you’re working with you also mentioned yesterday that you are visiting some physics surgeons and even observing the other operation procedure looks like what I see is a problem today under on our field is that so many professionals kind of hide in their own field you know and they just do their own work whatever they do and they just are afraid to cooperate with other professionals because they wrongly things that they are their competition but not in your case why do you think the bridging the gap between these fields is the way to go well I can only talk about my experience durian and and the thing is for me I sense up since I got into the industry I’ve always worked with other professionals and I came to the realization very very early on in my career that I can never be everything to everybody so I needed to choose my path and my path is right now where I am I’m really really good at assessing backs and coaching people that’s my that’s my forte if someone comes to me with you know an extremely dysfunctional pathological neck or cervical spine that’s not really my locker it’s it’s or not my colleges it’s not my my area of expertise so I realized that I needed a team a cohesive team where we could also logistical II work together and we could cross refer and we could share ideas and it’s taken me a long time being in this country now falling for 12 years and it’s been a very tumultuous 12 years to get into performance rx and to have the team that are that I’ve got but I’ve got phenomenal physiotherapists yeah I’ve got general practitioners I’ve got functional medicine specialists I’ve got a RT and fascial stretch therapy massage therapists I’ve got a chiropractor who I’ll work with who’s a really really good chiropractor and they have skills that I don’t have and likewise I have skills they don’t have and at the end of the day the patients are the ones that benefit from all of us speaking the same language and all of us not competing for a very small space because that’s I always try to have an abundance mentality there’s enough for everyone to go you know there’s enough to go around for everyone you know I

always believe you know if you just hoard things for yourself your world becomes smaller and smaller and if my physios and my chiropractor if if they have success I have success right and if I have success they have success so I have the ability to to to pass the patients on to another expert if I don’t have my smile and vice versa with regards to my orthopedic surgeons I’ve been observing surgery for the last 20 plus years back in South Africa I started observing knee surgery funny enough with my knee orthopedic surgeon back in South Africa and when I came here I just continued that I befriended a lot of the orthopedic surgeons in the area and they we now work very closely together and I’m very very lucky because a lot of the orthopedic surgeons now refer directly to me for back pain patients and we work closely and when I need them they were there I mentioned yesterday in the in the in the course that it was just as recently as last week and I’ve been working with the young girl that we are now six or seven months down the line and she just had a massive disk herniation that was in trapping the s-1 nerve root we had no success in anything that we were doing she’s had a few spinal injections when after a very very transient a matter relief wasn’t wasn’t long term and unfortunately she had to have surgery on Friday and spoke to her this morning and surgery’s been you know incredibly successful and so far she’s using you know she’s new codes of sorts but I’m sometimes you need surgeons and I think that’s another thing that I’m starting to see on social media and Facebook there are a lot of clinicians and trainers now are basically saying that you can dismiss orthopedic surgeons you don’t need them to cochran they become too cocky a bit Wow I would never be arrogant enough to say that I would I would fear the repercussions if I ever said that because I need my orthopedic surgeons I need mothers yours I need my mom I am NOT makaras because that’s the team that allows my clients to get results do two at the same team you know I seduced by chiropractors he’s got physio he’s got trainers in Canada he’s got all four Pedic surgeons and so so really you know my thinking is just a an extension of what she has taught me so well let’s let’s finish this talk by you say a few words about about yourself so who you are as a person what more the doing this in this person as you are what kind of difficulties whatever you know can help you to get better as a coach and a person who’s brought to life that’s a big question that’s a really big question well Jerry I’m gonna I’m gonna say that to answer that I’ve had many people assist me in molding my life many people it started off a very long time ago with my karate teacher a gentleman by the name of Stan Schmidt and Stan was a phenomenal inspiration and still his very large inspirational character in my life I think about Stan enlightened them Stan was the karate version of Stu for me okay so and then I transitioned obviously into strength conditioning from karate and my mentor there was funny enough for stan smith’s son-in-law ah and his name is Marshall giant and Mark and I started the very first personal training German Johannesburg there’s personal training this is a long long time ago back in Johannesburg and Mark was a phenomenal teacher not just in strength conditioning for me but Mark taught me a lot of life lessons and I owe a lot to to stand and walk more recently and he holds a very very dear place in my heart because I know him

really well and streamer Gil is one of the most amazing men that I’ve ever had pleasure and experience of meeting and really if you ask Stu how him and I met it was pure and total South African stubbornness on my part in in making sure I got to speak to him and got to see Liam and you know when I first met you he said to me Joel I’m a really busy man he was actually presenting here in London at an orthopedics conference and he said I’m a really busy man he said um I know you want to speak to me and ask me questions but I’ve got five minutes that’s it’s true five minutes is all I need and I said I’m really appreciative of your time and five minutes turned into three hours and three hours is turned into 12 years and Stuart is you know he’s he’s someone that I think about on a daily basis whether it be you know implementing his work thinking about the the advice he’s given me in life so he’s molded me in a very positive way okay and I must mention obviously that I’m a family man and my wife and my two kids are incredible people because they allow me the freedom to be at work from 6:00 a.m. until 8:00 p.m. Monday to Friday they allow me the freedom to be able to travel the world with you and teaching and come to your home for a living if they miss lavinia in September to to teach and my wife has a lot to put up with because I’m not an easy guy to live with I’m very you know single minded and single focused and I want to succeed in are the helping people growing my business or or allowing other people to succeed but she’s she’s an amazing woman that has Stu stood by me and my kids are you know they all my life my kids on my life I’ve got two girls and they keep both my life and actually me busy my wife more than me because I’m here but and then obviously you know my parents and you know I’ve had I’ve had a really good close family upbringing which is which has really molded me really well but life has never been easy and I’ve never wanted it easy during I’ve never ever wanted it easy because an easy life I don’t believe is a very rewarding life you know I’ve had to work very very hard I’ve had to their times that those are open businesses and they failed and I’ve tried certain things and they failed but maybe it’s very ignorant that I’ve just persevered because I don’t know any other way and now I have this I’m in a very very fortunate position to work and lecture for Stu and my and my fellow colleague at Cambridge also lectures first you I’d get you to travel the world with the two of them and we go and have a lot of fun so I’m I’m very grateful well it was a very very nice explaining and giving out your thoughts for us so see see do you see again in September absolutely 22nd of September and one 2nd of September in Slovenia lagana so you’re all welcome to join us and the poor westward and of course absolutely I look forward to to seeing everyone in Slovenia as Jerry said it’s September 22nd and just the the opportunity to come to Slovenia I’ve never been able for any opportunity to come and share my knowledge and share all of Stu’s amazing work that he’s done over his Korea is extremely humbling for me and I look forward and thank you for your time thank you as well [Applause] you

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